Very simple, there is no christ. Jesus died and we don’t have his body. This is not uncommon for the time. Even if the story about the empty tomb is true, an empty tomb does not prove a resurrection.
“But there were hundreds of witnesses”… according to one witness. We don’t have hundreds of accounts of the resurrection. We have a few, and they disagree with each other.
FACT 1: A Jewish Rabbi named Jesus of Nazareth was killed by crucifixion in the first century by Roman executioners.
FACT 2: Jesus’ followers had real experiences after Jesus’ death that they believed were appearances of Jesus, risen from the dead.
FACT 3: Jesus’ followers’ lives were transformed as a result of this belief—even to the point of being willing to die for their belief in His resurrection.
FACT 4: James and Paul – both enemies of Jesus’ message – came to believe in Jesus’ resurrection and became Christians as a result. Both claimed the reason was that Jesus spoke to them after His death.
FACT 5: Jesus was buried in a tomb in Jerusalem which was found empty shortly after His death.
these are a series of facts most historians agree with
The body being stolen and the disciples lying cannot be true due to facts 4, 2 and 3
hallucination theories are proven false due to fact 4 and 5
Jesus “didnt really die” theories are disproven due to fact 1 and 4
FACT 1: A Jewish Rabbi named Jesus of Nazareth was killed by crucifixion in the first century by Roman executioners.
Sure, I think something like this happened based on available evidence, though it is scant.
FACT 2: Jesus’ followers had real experiences after Jesus’ death that they believed were appearances of Jesus, risen from the dead.
This is not a fact. This is a claim made long after Jesus died. But maybe they believed magic happened, sure.
FACT 3: Jesus’ followers’ lives were transformed as a result of this belief—even to the point of being willing to die for their belief in His resurrection.
Some people flew planes into buildings, dying for their beliefs. Does that make them true?
What happened at Jonestown? Many more people died there, does that make it more true?
FACT 4: James and Paul – both enemies of Jesus’ message – came to believe in Jesus’ resurrection and became Christians as a result. Both claimed the reason was that Jesus spoke to them after His death.
Maybe they missed their pal and thought about him a lot.
FACT 5: Jesus was buried in a tomb in Jerusalem which was found empty shortly after His death.
Sure.
these are a series of facts most historians agree with
None of which suggest the existence of magic. Jesus was a cult leader, and his cult was repurposed to suit someone else’s agenda.
The body being stolen and the disciples lying cannot be true due to facts 4, 2 and 3
Yes, both can still be true. People steal bodies, even shortly after death, especially if he was a popular or famous person. People cling to false beliefs even if it kills them, sometimes.
hallucination theories are proven false due to fact 4 and 5
No, still perfectly possible.
Jesus “didnt really die” theories are disproven due to fact 1 and 4
I find this one unlikely anyway, but it is possible he had a double killed in his place. I suspect he really did die. I have no reason to believe he or anyone else was resurrected after 3 days.
He turned fishermen into scholars and philosophers and theologians. Their lives were radically transformed
I’m not sure you get this. This is like Donald Trump waking up one day, disbanding ICE, apologizing for his actions, turning himself in for those crimes and putting welfare above warfare.
Alright
If Jesus and his followers were lying, James and Paul would’ve been the PERFECT semi-biased-against-them investigators. But they investigated and converted.
If it was a hallucination, why would his tomb be empty and james and paul converted after investigation?
No, it is not. The fact is that they made a claim. What they claimed is evidently not factual.
He turned fishermen into scholars and philosophers and theologians. Their lives were radically transformed
They followed a cult leader and got themselves killed for false beliefs. You think that’s a good outcome?
I’m not sure you get this. This is like Donald Trump waking up one day, disbanding ICE, apologizing for his actions, turning himself in for those crimes and putting welfare above warfare.
I’m not sure you get this. It doesn’t matter how much people like a guy, that doesn’t make him correct.
If Jesus and his followers were lying, James and Paul would’ve been the PERFECT semi-biased-against-them investigators. But they investigated and converted.
They were fooled like the others. Jesus’s message was hypocritical, dangerous, and stupid, but he was evidently very persuasive.
If it was a hallucination, why would his tomb be empty and james and paul converted after investigation?
These are three separate things.
The tomb may not have been empty at all, we cannot verify historically. But if it was, I find it more likely that someone took the body than that a dead man came back to life after so much time.
Hallucinations may happen independently of whether the tomb was empty or not. Believers may have imagined Jesus, or dreamed about him, or hallucinated while on some kind of drug. It’s also possible look-alikes claimed to be him, or (unlikely) Jesus faked his own death and appeared to them himself. It’s also possible the claims are simply false, we have no way of verifying. I find all of these explanations more likely than a miraculous resurrection.
As for James and Paul, it only shows that they were convinced, not that the resurrection was true. And how do we know Jesus appeared to James? Because Paul said so? It’s also worth noting that Paul’s teachings deviate from and conflict with Jesus’s. Whatever he saw, it likely was not the same character we read about in the gospels.
Do you support healthy gay relationships?
I support the people, not the sin
By calling it sin, you oppress the people.
Fuck you for choosing death.
How many more suicides do you think there will be this year alone?
How do you explain the resurrection of Christ?
Very simple, there is no christ. Jesus died and we don’t have his body. This is not uncommon for the time. Even if the story about the empty tomb is true, an empty tomb does not prove a resurrection.
“But there were hundreds of witnesses”… according to one witness. We don’t have hundreds of accounts of the resurrection. We have a few, and they disagree with each other.
FACT 1: A Jewish Rabbi named Jesus of Nazareth was killed by crucifixion in the first century by Roman executioners.
FACT 2: Jesus’ followers had real experiences after Jesus’ death that they believed were appearances of Jesus, risen from the dead.
FACT 3: Jesus’ followers’ lives were transformed as a result of this belief—even to the point of being willing to die for their belief in His resurrection.
FACT 4: James and Paul – both enemies of Jesus’ message – came to believe in Jesus’ resurrection and became Christians as a result. Both claimed the reason was that Jesus spoke to them after His death.
FACT 5: Jesus was buried in a tomb in Jerusalem which was found empty shortly after His death.
these are a series of facts most historians agree with
The body being stolen and the disciples lying cannot be true due to facts 4, 2 and 3
hallucination theories are proven false due to fact 4 and 5
Jesus “didnt really die” theories are disproven due to fact 1 and 4
Sure, I think something like this happened based on available evidence, though it is scant.
This is not a fact. This is a claim made long after Jesus died. But maybe they believed magic happened, sure.
Some people flew planes into buildings, dying for their beliefs. Does that make them true?
What happened at Jonestown? Many more people died there, does that make it more true?
Maybe they missed their pal and thought about him a lot.
Sure.
None of which suggest the existence of magic. Jesus was a cult leader, and his cult was repurposed to suit someone else’s agenda.
Yes, both can still be true. People steal bodies, even shortly after death, especially if he was a popular or famous person. People cling to false beliefs even if it kills them, sometimes.
No, still perfectly possible.
I find this one unlikely anyway, but it is possible he had a double killed in his place. I suspect he really did die. I have no reason to believe he or anyone else was resurrected after 3 days.
alright
This is a fact
He turned fishermen into scholars and philosophers and theologians. Their lives were radically transformed
I’m not sure you get this. This is like Donald Trump waking up one day, disbanding ICE, apologizing for his actions, turning himself in for those crimes and putting welfare above warfare.
Alright
If Jesus and his followers were lying, James and Paul would’ve been the PERFECT semi-biased-against-them investigators. But they investigated and converted.
If it was a hallucination, why would his tomb be empty and james and paul converted after investigation?
No, it is not. The fact is that they made a claim. What they claimed is evidently not factual.
They followed a cult leader and got themselves killed for false beliefs. You think that’s a good outcome?
I’m not sure you get this. It doesn’t matter how much people like a guy, that doesn’t make him correct.
They were fooled like the others. Jesus’s message was hypocritical, dangerous, and stupid, but he was evidently very persuasive.
These are three separate things.
The tomb may not have been empty at all, we cannot verify historically. But if it was, I find it more likely that someone took the body than that a dead man came back to life after so much time.
Hallucinations may happen independently of whether the tomb was empty or not. Believers may have imagined Jesus, or dreamed about him, or hallucinated while on some kind of drug. It’s also possible look-alikes claimed to be him, or (unlikely) Jesus faked his own death and appeared to them himself. It’s also possible the claims are simply false, we have no way of verifying. I find all of these explanations more likely than a miraculous resurrection.
As for James and Paul, it only shows that they were convinced, not that the resurrection was true. And how do we know Jesus appeared to James? Because Paul said so? It’s also worth noting that Paul’s teachings deviate from and conflict with Jesus’s. Whatever he saw, it likely was not the same character we read about in the gospels.
Paul’s experience may be consistent with symptoms of temporal lobe epilepsy: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1032067/